Polyamory’s Biggest Struggle Isn’t Jealousy — It’s Scheduling EP.127
Most people think the toughest part of polyamory is jealousy. But according to Richie, it’s actually… logistics. Yep, the calendar.
After a life-changing cancer journey with his partner, Richie realized that the hardest part of opening their relationship wasn’t emotions, it was managing schedules, consent, and privacy across multiple partners. With his background in software product management, he decided to do something about it, and created PYE, a scheduling and consent management app designed specifically for the polyamorous community.
In this episode of Nope! We’re Not Monogamous, Richie and I dig into:
Why scheduling is considered an “unsolvable math problem” (and why we need more self-compassion when we feel polyunsaturated).
How misunderstandings about dates, boundaries, and consent are quietly breaking relationships.
The creative ways poly folks use calendars as safety tools.
Why color coding, structure, and intentional planning actually free us up for more intimacy and fun.
Richie’s vision for cutting down burnout and building more trusting, joyful relationships with better tools.
If you’ve ever juggled multiple Google Calendars, forgotten to communicate a boundary, or lost a relationship to logistics overwhelm — this one’s for you.
👉 Learn more about PYE and grab one of the free-for-life beta spots at www.lovepye.com
Two Awesome People
New Episodes Every Monday and Thursday!
Listen on: Apple Podcasts Spotify
📰 Subscribe to Not A Monogamous Newsletter to stay up to date with new episodes and offerings from Ellecia. https://elleciapaine.podia.com/newsletter
❤️ Enjoying the show? The best way to thank us is by following and leaving a review or a note. And if you want more, join our Patreon! http://www.patreon.com/notmonogamous
👀 Find Us Online
🌍 Website: https://www.elleciapaine.com
📘 Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/elleciapaine
📸 Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/elleciapaine/
Music: Composer/Author (CA): Oscar Lindstein
STIM IPI: 572 393 237
TRANSCRIPT:
Ellecia: [00:00:00] Have you ever tried dating three people co-parenting, running a business and still finding time for yourself? Spoiler. It's not just a communication issue, it's a logistics nightmare. So this week on Nope! we're Not Monogamous Richie joins me to talk about why scheduling is actually one of polyamory biggest pain points and how his new app PYE is helping partners build trust, consent, and connection without drowning in their Google calendars.
Ellecia: Welcome back to Nope! We're Not Monogamous, the podcast where we tell all the truths about love and sex and relationships outside of the Monogamous Box. I'm your host, Ellecia Paine', and today we're tackling something that polyamory memes make look funny, but that actually breaks relationships faster than even jealousy does.
Ellecia: It's the logistics. My guest is Richie, a software guy turned polyamory problem solver, who after his partner's Cancer journey, they shifted their priorities and discovered that the hardest part of opening up wasn't the [00:01:00] emotions, it was the calendar. So now he's on a mission to help the polyamorous community managed their schedules, their boundaries, and consent without burning out or blowing up their relationship.
Ellecia: We're talking about why scheduling is an unsolvable math problem and how lack of informed consent sneaks into date planning and why structure might actually free us up for more intimacy. This conversation's gonna give you a whole new lens on the L word, not love logistics. Cool. Okay. So, welcome to, Nope!, we're not monogamous.
Richie: Thank you. You're so welcome. Oh,
Ellecia: I have been really interested to talk to you because we've had a few back and forth emails about your app, which looks amazing. And so I've been really curious about you and what brought that about and more about the app and whatnot. So before I ask you a million questions about that, can you, can you just share for the listeners a [00:02:00] little bit about, a little bit about who you are.
Richie: Sure. Well, so outside of the spicy life I am a four. She soon to be 41-year-old. I'm turning 41 on Saturday with, uh, with my little family out in the middle of the mountains in British Columbia, Canada. Which is interesting on the spicy side 'cause we 'were we apparently love to travel everywhere.
Richie: We live in a town of about 9,000 people. It's a, it's a ski town, like, kind of kinda like your Telluride, uh, kind of idea. Which we love. you know, obviously, there's a lot of outdoors activities and mountain biking, skiing, all that fun stuff. But it's a town of 9,000 people. So, you know, there's very cool people, interesting people here, but there's also.
Richie: Discretion and, uh, and a lot of travel to like kind of the next town over to, uh, to meet people.
Ellecia: Yeah.
Richie: On the spicier side of things, my partner and I have been we opened our relationship [00:03:00] about, uh, about a year ago-ish. My wife went through a yearlong successful battle with breast cancer, um, and which, you know, makes you.
Richie: Kind of reevaluate what life is about and how to appreciate it that much more. And I, and that's kind of started the conversation of, while we've been married for a long time and what, what else is going on out there? And that's just opened up a whole journey when on our, you know, in terms of our relationship meeting people getting honestly, surprisingly into poly.
Richie: And then learning, learning what that whole world has been about. Um, but then also, uh. Combining that with so my professional background for the last several years has been in software development as, um, what you call a product manager. So not the, not the usual techie guy coding things, but more so the person who talks to people and figures out what problems they have to solve and [00:04:00] kind of figure out the business case for things.
Richie: And actually the first folks that we got involved with in poly, some of those first conversations where we're like, huh, what is this all about? That's, you know, not necessarily what we were expecting, but we're interested. While those first conversations were actually about scheduling, which is surprising that, you know, you kinda come in expecting there's gonna be o salacious and fascinating.
Richie: And it is. But you know, they also like us. We have a, we have a young kid, so do they, and. That just means there's a lot of life, a lot of life to plan around. And they'd been, uh, in Poly for several years. So they were, you know, kind of veterans of figuring out who can date, when, who's, who's actually available, what details do you share or not, or what have you.
Richie: So I was just kind of spell bumbed by this, but then they're just talking about how much work it all is and it isn't, it isn't a solved thing, which. As a person who likes to [00:05:00] help people with technology, I was like, huh, maybe there's something here. And that's how I started digging in. So, so that led to PYE, which is the app I've been working on.
Richie: I think it was kind of May, uh, was, uh, when I started on it. And it's now a real thing which you can actually use. Improve your dating life and balance all your relationships and that, which is, it's awesome to get to it, get it to this point, but, you know, and we're trying to also get feedback and make it a really useful tool.
Richie: Yeah. So without getting too deep into that journey, that's kind of, not only did it, you know, mean building some piece of technology, but it's also meant talking to. Dozens of people and, you know, reading every Reddit post I can find and just learning a ton about how people manage this crazy life we call pulley.
Ellecia: Yeah.
Richie: I'm kind of keen to talk about and share, share what I've learned, learned a lot more. 'cause there, it's, [00:06:00] it's a bottomless source of information and, and intrigue.
Ellecia: Yeah.
Ellecia: Yeah. Amazing. Amazing. Um, first of all, thank you for for sharing. All of that. And congratulations to your wife for beating the big C there.
Ellecia: That's terrifying. Can you, it was, can you share a little bit about how that moment shifted your shifted your relationship structure?
Richie: Well, yeah, so, I mean, it really was for us, like we'd been married, you know, 12 plus years at that point. And I think, you know, both of us are, you know, people who, like other people, we have a, you know, we've always been people who are community builders.
Richie: Yeah. And of course you meet people who are, you know, extra interesting. But you know, in the normal bounds you kind of, you know, set that aside. And when my wife got through that journey, we were start to talk about like, [00:07:00] well, what. You know, what is this all about? What is life? You know, we've got all the basics in arranged now we've overcome this big struggle.
Richie: Um, it's gotta all be worth it, right? The struggle has to be worth some thing, and I can't even remember the specific conversation, but opening up our relationship kingdom to the four is just something that we're both interested in and curious about. And that, and that's where we always start, right?
Richie: Yeah. Hey, what, what's going on out there? What are the options? Um, yeah, turns out there's a few. Yeah. And then, you know, like, you know, we were lucky, like our relationship was really strong, especially after the cancer journey. So, you know, we weren't coming at it from a place of deficit. But, you know, how do you also extend that strong sense of bonding?
Richie: Like any monogamous couple you, you wear into the patterns and. Then suddenly something disrupts and you're like, [00:08:00] wow, you can be a lot more intimate with each other than, than you had previously been. And then, so we want to keep building on that. Yeah. But of course, you know, if otherwise, if you don't do anything different, you will settle back into the same patterns you had before.
Richie: We didn't want life to be the same.
Ellecia: Yeah. Yeah. That makes so much sense. Absolutely. Absolutely. Uh, you know, a lot of the people I talk to, um. A lot of the, the struggles that people imagine there are or, or really focus on are, uh, the emotional struggles, the feelings. And you have mentioned that, um, scheduling is, is one of the biggest issues.
Ellecia: So why do you think that logistics get kind of forgotten or underestimated so much?
Richie: Because they show up as communication and emotional issues. Mm-hmm. Like really the more I've talked. You know, there's that cause and effect, right? And I often think what we think is the cause is the effect, [00:09:00] right?
Richie: Because when we're having happy conversations and just connecting, having out on a date, having a lot of fun, like those are the happy times, right? That those are the times when there's not a lot of struggle and you're, you're focused on each other and life's good. Where does conflict arise? It's when there are uneven expectations about this date or the status of this relationship.
Richie: It's, Hey, I'm feeling neglected. You know, you've been out a lot with other people and I'm feeling like I'm not seeing you that often. It's, um, what else have I heard? Sense of security, like litter of physical security. Like, I'm worried about your security and I haven't, we haven't talked about what, uh, how you're protecting yourself or how I can protect you.
Richie: I mean, it, it bubbles up in so many ways, but it really does come down to people are living this life and. We don't necessarily think to share or we overshare and we try and plan [00:10:00] ahead, but then plans change. That's disruptive. There's a million reasons that the logistics just cause hurt. Confusion.
Richie: Misunderstanding. So it's when that thing where you scratch the surface and Google Calendar keeps showing up. That was really interesting to me.
Ellecia: Uhhuh. Uhhuh, Uhhuh. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. It's um.
Ellecia: I am, I'm curious. Okay. When you talk about Google Calendar what do you, what do you mean there? What,
Richie: or just, just to, I mean, as proxy for, 'cause it, it is the, the thing I think most people are using right now Sure. That's good or bad of is it's like if you're gonna try and organize your life at all, that's the, the free option.
Richie: Right. It's, it's, you know, just a way of saying that it's really about the logistics of who's where. With you doing what if everyone, if the right people have the right information and everyone's on page things run smoothly. As soon as a piece of that breaks down between like that'll harm relationships of it.
Richie: I'm so [00:11:00] sad to read and hear from people who are like, my relationship broke down just because this other partner was fantastic, but couldn't give me a heads up to schedule things. I was constantly surprised. Yeah. Like to me, this is this avoidable problem. So there's the risk to the relationships. On that side, but then you hear a lot about polys saturation burnout.
Richie: And that comes, that's the other side of scheduling is like, I, it's not just my dating life. I'm scheduling my time over and I'm a limited resource. Yeah. Right. And you know, I, as especially an DHD person, totally longer could just go down a rabbit hole with people and spend all my time chatting and dating and all that, but.
Richie: You know, there's a real cost to that comes that time comes from somewhere. So, you know, when people get overwhelmed you look back at the schedule and think, man, you were really packing your time. Right. Did you, were you intentional about the schedule [00:12:00] you created? Were you protecting your free time?
Richie: Were you booking dates to have a sense of obligation or were you respecting. Your own need first, which it sounds selfish, but it's not. No. I need to be able to, how be well slept, balanced, exercised, show up with being, being able to be present. Yeah. Right. So again, it's like, scratch the surface, there's the sand again.
Ellecia: Yeah. Yeah. And then that all of that, being able to take care of yourself goes back to how you manage the feelings part. Ah, exactly. Uh, the number of times I, I have, uh, many calendars and shared with many different people. The number of times that it's been set in my house. Oh, I didn't realize you were doing that.
Ellecia: Well, I put it on the calendar. Well, there's so much stuff on the calendar. I can't even see it. I don't know
Richie: exactly
Ellecia: like there's the kids, multiple partners, businesses, like so many things on the calendar. [00:13:00]
Richie: Well, I, so I am. If you can't tell quite a nerd. Uh, so one of my favorite pieces of information I've come across in my journey was actually an academic study.
Richie: There was, it was, I think they use inverse of Edinburgh. They found that poly scheduling, specifically, like trying to get, I think they used a, a range of three to seven partners to align schedules. Is one of the most challenging mathematical problems in math. It's not solved and there are speculations.
Richie: It will never be solved. It is so complex 'cause you think you, you think you've got it all arranged and then one person's schedule change. You can't go on one day. Well now if you backfill that with another date, then that's means you're not at home, which means that your other partner can't go out like it explodes.
Richie: It's actually a crazy undertaking what we're doing here, right. That's aside from being interesting, and I think like it [00:14:00] gave me a lot of empathy and sympathy for people, like we're we are doing something extremely hard. Yeah. And with real consequences. Like hurt feelings and surprises lead to real impact, right?
Ellecia: Yeah.
Richie: So, yeah. We're doing something hard here.
Ellecia: Yeah. Uh, yeah. Yeah. We really are. It's, it is truly.
Richie: Sure. It's, it's academically verified. It's really hard.
Ellecia: Yeah.
Richie: Um, yeah. Yeah. So, and you, you were speaking to, I am actually somewhat curious if I might question, toss the question back. I'd love to hear more about just how, because you're, you're, you've got a ton of experience.
Richie: You're obviously very good at what you do. Tell me a little bit about how you manage your schedule with the, the many different things you've got going on. What does that look like?
Ellecia: It, you know, it's actually, it's not that bad anymore. Yeah, my kids are teenagers and they don't, they don't have as many things that take my time which is really helpful compared to when they [00:15:00] were little and had like a million things. And my, my partners have pretty predictable schedules, which is really nice. But we still run into, you know, which, which nights are available to hang out, which ones aren't, and then that changing, oh shoot, I forgot that my other partner had this going on.
Ellecia: We gotta change it. Like, we still run into that all the time.
Richie: Yeah. Well, and, and like the, what's out there right now, again, I'm not picking on Google Calendar 'cause actually. Integrate with Google Calendar. I think it's super important to keep and useful for scheduling the rest of your life. Right. I think you're like, of all the people I've talked to in my, in my experience, like you're, you're on the like sophisticated side.
Richie: You've got the like multiple shared calendars set up, you color coding things probably. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Doing all the things. You're doing everything right.
Ellecia: Yeah. But it took a long time to figure that out.
Richie: One long one. Two, probably a lot of investment. Yeah. Like figuring out what actually [00:16:00] works. And then you're probably on the upper end of that, you know, spectrum of like people who are like highly organized and, and actually like spending time on the calendar to like the YOLO folk, like just vibing their way through life.
Richie: Usually haven't seen a calendar in years, but love being on text. I hated
Ellecia: calendars until I became polyamorous. I was like, I, and it wasn't the, it wasn't the polyamory that I needed it for. It was actually just the multiple different parts of my life that I was like, oh, I gotta figure this out, or I can't function.
Richie: Well, that was our experience too, is it takes, you know, our lives were always busy. Like we have, we're in still night, young kid bracket, there's the afterschool activities, whatever. Yeah. I mean, that's very predictable. But then it just takes all that, it says like, crank set up to 10. Right. Where, well, like, so yeah, one is like literally logistically you gotta find time for stuff and you're, you know, one side of it is like, it is depressing to hear when people are like, yeah, we sit down on a [00:17:00] Sunday and we open up two laptops and have two phones going that we can see four calendars at once. And you know, isn't it wonderful?
Richie: We, it'd be wonderful. Everything was in one view, fantastic, right? Typical software stuff, but then. The other side's, like you talk about, it's the emotional side of like, oh suddenly it's really important to know what's coming up because not only are you like logistically worried like, am I around, but like, am I emotionally prepared for my partner to see a new partner?
Richie: You know, what do I need to, what work do I need to do ahead of time? How much time do I need? Do I need like two weeks heads up to like have some processing time? Think about things, you know, that's, I think that's pretty reasonable or. Plans change. Well, how can I give, um, as much head notice as I can or, um, one thing I built in right away I knew was super important beyond just the timed and dates were things like boundaries, right?
Richie: We I think from what I've talked to people like [00:18:00] consent is super important, but it's very informal. Like, it's like, Hey, didn't we talk about that at some point via text or. You know, where was that in the text messages or, oh, we were on the phone when I talked about it last date. Well, you know, boundaries around, uh, using protection or when, you know, is an overnight.
Richie: Okay. What activities are Okay. Should, should we bring, bring our families or not? Right? All this stuff. If it's not written down in a place where everyone can see it, I'd argue you don't actually have consent. Well, not unfair to consent, right? That that's a real risk where I thought you were gonna do this, but you didn't like, even like, it's happened to us where it's just like, oh, we didn't think to talk about that.
Richie: So having like a, Hey, I gotta sit down, I'm gonna fill out, you know, this is where I'm booking and these are the boundaries I'm expecting. It's an important exercise. But then. So in my [00:19:00] system it's, that's right on the the date invitation, the booking and all that. So then when everyone says yes to that, they're saying yes to not only the date and time, but they're like, oh, and I know that they're going this place.
Richie: They're gonna check in at this time, they're going to do these things, they're not gonna do these things. This, it doesn't, it's not about layering on restrictions, it's just about everyone knowing and agreeing expressly in what I call informed consent.
Ellecia: Yeah.
Richie: Right. That's where trust is actually built rather than lost.
Richie: Can you do that with your Google Calendar? Sure. Like ref, you know, there's a, there's a description section in there. Use it aggressively. But, um, I think it's an important, it's something true or important for just a conversation. It's something that needs to. Endure that. Uh, so I think it needs to be part of the way you think about, you know, arranging your dating life.
Ellecia: That's actually really brilliant. The I the idea of the idea. The example that comes to mind for me is a [00:20:00] couple has these agreements that they've created around dating outside. But whoever they're dating maybe doesn't know what those agreements are. It hasn't come up, it hasn't like. They just aren't sharing it.
Ellecia: So actually having it there as a, like a written, you know, like a a, it reminds me of combining your Google calendar with like a, a dating owning owner's manual. Like, here's all of my information that is important for you to have before you date me, before we spend time intimately or whatever. That's brilliant.
Richie: Well, and, and then like part of it, what inspired that for us was they. When you're starting out and opening your relationship, you have no clue what you're talking,
Ellecia: you know? Yeah, no.
Richie: Right. Like you're, you're going by feel, you're meeting people. You're like, I think initially we'd even said like, no polyamory, or, that's too much very common.
Richie: And then, or some of the first people we were like, oh, well that actually doesn't seem that bad at [00:21:00] all. Like they, they've kind of figured out what's going on here. So like, it evolves. So writing like one document to rule them all that, you know, the stone tablets doesn't actually reflect reality. Like consent and boundaries change over time depending on the person.
Richie: And that's okay. But it's not, doesn't mean it's not important to write it down, share it and celebrity to it.
Ellecia: Yeah.
Richie: And I think it's just a really healthy practice to adopt, right?
Ellecia: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's, that's lovely. We, um, we lean really heavily on conversation to, to make things work. But it sounds like having, having that little bit of structure actually frees up our conversation time.
Richie: That's exactly, exactly. Like, well, yeah, 'cause it comes up like one you don't wanna spend all your time talking about logistics, it boring and it actually sucks a little bit energy, right? Yeah. Like, like when I talked about like before, like the monogamy groove. I think a lot of that comes from the fact that you just get used to talking with, like, about [00:22:00] logistics all the time with the same person.
Richie: So you start to see them as like, Hey, you're your business partner. Right? Yeah. So I, I'm, I'm a fan of talking about a logistics just enough. Hmm. Right. Uh, and those conversations are important. So they're one, it's one thing to have them, but, and you don't wanna spend a lot of time with them. But then it's like those omissions and like, like I mentioned, I'm a DHD and.
Richie: God bless this community we're in. There's a lot of neurodiversity, right? With with that comes executive function, deficits. I forget to mention things. Yeah. From time to time. Um, and I feel so bad, so bad when it's like, oh, I forgot to mention, I forgot to ask. Right. I talked about it, but I forgot to rate it down.
Ellecia: Yeah.
Richie: And then the consequence comes the broken trust, the. Disappointment. The the expectations inflated and I'm like, [00:23:00] I legitimately feel bad. It's kind of my fault. I didn't raise this. I mean, there's no good reason not I didn't. But you know, I, I, part of my mission here is just to support people from the paying the mental tax that they, the neurodiversity tax that I occasionally pay.
Richie: So, that's another side to it. Yeah.
Ellecia: Absolutely. Absolutely. You didn't tell me. I'm sure I did. My God, we've had that conversation so many times. I didn't know about this. I'm positive. I told you maybe I didn't. Yeah, I don't know. I can't keep track of who I told things to.
Richie: And when that information that was in the right place that you're actually gonna look at it.
Richie: 'cause again, you could write things down a piece of paper and Yeah. For me, and it will disappear. It's gone. Yeah. But if you're on that. That date booking that I know is coming up, I'm gonna check it. I get a, I get a notification like, oh yeah, that date's come up. Oh, right. That, that thing, oh, I forgot to talk [00:24:00] about that.
Richie: If I can catch myself two days ahead of time, that's so much better than catching myself at the moment Right. When I'm on the way up the door. Oh, by the way.
Ellecia: Absolutely. Absolutely. I'm curious, what where did you get the name for the app?
Richie: Hmm. I, I followed the. Sorry, I, I, I'm a bit sarcastic by nature.
Richie: I've followed the well worn app path of taking a popular word and changing one letter. I, um, uh, the, the idea of pie came from, you know, everyone wants a slice of you. The pie is your time, and you're, you're very tasty people. We are very tasty, and we're, we're delicious. So everyone wants the slice. So how do you divide that pie up, right?
Richie: So again, it's, it's, it becomes more than scheduling. It's really about how do I manage my relationship life. Was, that's where the name came from and it made a kind of interesting logo too, and you can riff off I all the, all day. It's [00:25:00] fun, very fun marketing this thing.
Ellecia: Yeah. Yeah. That's that's amazing. I, I thought that that's what it was, but I was like, maybe there's something else there.
Richie: No, it's not, it's not that deep. No, no. There's.
Ellecia: I mean,
Richie: although there was, um, in between here, like I said, um, we live in a small town that's away from other towns. So like the one partner was like two hours away, but there was a, there's a great bakery in between here and there. So, as she was giving advice on the app, I actually like bought her a pie one day and brought it to germ, like, oh, thank you.
Richie: So it works. That's
Ellecia: amazing. That's amazing. You mentioned earlier safety and I'm, I'm curious, what are some, uh, like creative or unexpected ways people use their scheduling for safety? Right.
Richie: Yeah, something, well, okay. [00:26:00] First of all, like, define what we're talking about. Safety, uh, like. What I hear when I talk to people, like there's like emotional thinking, but I'm talking about literal safety.
Richie: And I, you know, as a, as a male don't truly can't truly appreciate how big of a risk it is to go out as if meeting someone, especially if it's new. But, you know, partner violence exists and it's not limited to monogamous relationships.
Richie: Yeah.
Richie: So I'm talking about like physical or like, you know, serious emotional safety, where it's like, is is my, am I or am I, is my partner gonna be treated well?
Richie: What's the backup plan? So, you know, it's as, it's as simple. It can be as simple as like setting an expectation, like check in, like, you know, I expect as a, as the stay at home partner you get a check in when you get there. And before midnight. Right. None of those are really simple, but it's just like, then it's not awkward when you're like pausing something.
Richie: You get like one sec, you know, it's [00:27:00] coming up on midnight. I better, I better jump out and send a text here. So, you know, no surprise. Yeah.
Ellecia: So it's like a pre-established expectation rather than I have to interrupt the conversation. Yeah.
Richie: Or, or you know, like if it's a new if it's a new connection. This is gonna be in a public place because that's safer or only, you know, it'll only go to a private place if, you know, I talk first or whatever.
Richie: We'll share locations or whatever. So like, there's that, there's the basic stuff like that. But then a couple of interesting ones come across. I mean sharing STI testing documentation, uh, in a, like a digital format. So there's a little bit of trust but verify there. But that, and then also, you know, another partner, uh, seeing that that exists, uh, you know, this is where, and we can pre probably talk about privacy a little bit later in discretion, but like, you know, being able to share that with the appropriate people is, is real confidence building.
Richie: So that was one interesting request. Less on the [00:28:00] Paul side, more on the e and m open relationship side. Um hmm. Folks will, folks will say, okay, we're gonna talk for a week, and then at the end of the week I'm gonna like invite you to set up a date, but we wanna send me a face shot, right? Just to, just so my partner knows, you know, if anything went awry, who this is, and, and it also demonstrates like, Hey, I'm actually got some skin in the game.
Richie: I'm gonna, you know, I'm gonna put myself out there before that first meeting. I thought that was really interesting, like just as a way of one, like filtering out people who maybe unserious or have nefarious purposes, but two, just like that confidence building between partners. So those were things that have built into the app to facilitate safety that way.
Ellecia: That's amazing. That's fantastic.
Richie: Well, you, this is the beauty building, like a, something specifically for our community is that there are all these niche considerations and yeah. Stuff [00:29:00] that you can do and structure right in. So it's, it becomes, you know, passade to just do this stuff.
Ellecia: Yeah, yeah, yeah. How how does privacy play into it?
Richie: Well, yeah, I mean, there's two sides to it. One is like literal data privacy. I mean, I'm very sympathetic and always watch out for hold on our friends in the United States right now, and it's not unique in the globe right now that this, you know, rising kind of enforcement of socially conservative values.
Richie: But we see, you know, like how scary is it that people's autism data is being collected in a central database by government right now? Right. And even in Canada, there's a. There's a bill on the table right now that would make it so that police wouldn't need a warrant to to grab data out of even dating apps about people's connections like that.
Richie: Not like, [00:30:00] you know, maybe not in a ton of depth, but still to know like, oh, they signed up for that app. They're a user there. Right. So I've been following, uh, what's called GDP or like European. Standards in hosting in Europe. Yeah. 'cause they tend to be the most aware, but like there is that literal security, encryption, all that stuff.
Richie: So that's super important considering the information we're quietly sharing about each other and our calendars. Who's, who's connected with who when like
Ellecia: Yeah.
Richie: It is interesting material. I mean, we don't love to think about that too often, so I'll do that for you. Yeah. But then there's like the more like the dis what I call the discretion side, right?
Richie: Where you're, you're trying to show, you're trying to give people the information they need to one plan, but two, like to build trust without oversharing. You're inner world trying to avoid jealousy. We're all trying to keep a balance, our relationships. So, and that's I think actually where one of the areas where.
Richie: The current calendar offerings. Offerings fall down. 'cause they were never built for that. Like [00:31:00] Google Calendar outlook, they were built for offices. Yeah. Where everyone shares mostly everything. You can book into anyone's calendar any time. Get in there, see what they're up to. 'cause it's all business stuff.
Richie: Yeah. Right. Um, or it's like one-to-one, but they, they, they weren't contemplating a scenario where, oh, my home partner needs to see some details about where I'm gonna be and who I'm gonna be with. But I don't wanna share that with. Three other people, but I want those three other people to still be able to see when I'm available.
Ellecia: Yeah, yeah.
Richie: Right, right. And I want those three people to see when I'm available, but not like every time. Like I don't want them booking in on Thursday afternoon, that's when I, that that's when I go biking or something like that. Like I, I, I want each specific, specific people to see this specific time. I want them to book this this often.
Richie: And that may be different between partners and relationship's, different. So, that's where I think it gets tricky, even a Google counter to kind of keep everyone in the right level of information [00:32:00] and, you know, the consequences if there's too much or too little information. Breaking trust. I don't know that, like, it is just uncomfortable to think that there's gonna be a little leak, if you can.
Richie: Right. And, and not to say it from the Farol, it's just. We're all trying to keep everyone in a happy place and focused on each other, not this whole complicated life remote.
Ellecia: Yeah. Yeah. That's amazing. I love that. What, looking ahead, what is your, like dream vision for how this app could shift? How, uh, how people like date and connect and, and do life.
Richie: So one I would love to see, I mean, you're never gonna end polys saturation or burnout. It's gonna happen. I'd love to kind of, we all tend to be a little
Ellecia: overindulgent.
Richie: Yeah. I mean we'd be, we'd be boring people to [00:33:00] date if we weren't indulgent people. Yeah. It's half the fun is just game to each other bitch.
Richie: Like the, the needless stuff where I just like, I overschedule myself or I like overcommit and now I feel like I'm not doing justice by anyone. I don't think that's necessary. Yeah. Right. With the right solution, we can avoid that. One big foundational piece of my app that's very different than everything else out there is that you, first thing you do is you set your dating schedule specific to dating.
Richie: Before you book anything, like it's, it's just laying out, this is when I want to be available, right? There's no booking into empty spaces, wherever, and the calendar's good. It's like I want, you know, Thursday evenings, uh, Saturday nights and Sunday mornings, but only every two weeks that, you know, that number of hours, those times just generally work well for me.
Richie: Like just an example. [00:34:00] But. Setting that out ahead of time. One, it like enables you to do a bunch of other stuff, but two, I love the practice of it. It's very intentional, saying absent of my partners and obligations, just like what's good for me and what, like, what's gonna let me show up? Well mm-hmm.
Richie: Right. Where I'm not gonna beat the, not overtaxed, um, that foundation of saying it's like Alan inclusive availability or it's. You book to the schedule you really want and intend to offer, and then you're not, you're automatically only sharing that. So it's, it's like a bit of a, um, a, a tweak on how people think about their schedule.
Richie: And I, I like that and I'd love people to think more intentionally about when do I actually want to date and what's my actual capacity. That words off a whole bunch of problems right off the bat. So I'd love to see that. Like cut down on burnout. You know, it's simple. Like [00:35:00] more love less logistics, like the less we can talk about, like, let's talk about the good stuff.
Richie: Let's talk about the interesting stuff. Like how do we come up with the boundaries that we're gonna use? Let's not have those cons and conversations all, remember we talked about like, those, those are boring or sucky conversations. Like, let's, let's focus on the, the meaningful stuff with our time. So I'd love to see that shift.
Richie: Yeah. And then proctor, like the privacy side, both the discretion and the data privacy, like, there's no reason people should feel insecure about what they're sharing out there, right? When you feel secure about the information you can share, then you feel free to actually share what matters.
Richie: Mm-hmm. You know, those, those surprises that come up where you forget to share something or you overshare something or whatever. Again, fully unnecessary. It breaks my heart when relat you see relationship posts, um, like on Reddit where people are like, oh, I forgot to tell someone this. Or like, my, my partner just [00:36:00] never includes me in their plans because it's, it's all heartbreaking.
Richie: 'cause it's not needed at all. Um, yeah. At the same time, I don't expect everything to be becoming a scheduling expert. So part of, part of the mission with this is just to make it easy. Like you. You log in, you link to your partner, and then it all magically appears and it highlight the important stuff without having to do a lot of setup.
Richie: 'Cause realistically, not everyone's gonna love Sha Joing, so how can we do the least amount of it, but do it well? Yeah. That's, that's my, that's my question.
Ellecia: Yeah. I love that. That's so good.
Richie: Yeah.
Ellecia: Is there anything I haven't asked you that you wanna share?
Richie: Uh, well, I think, we've been touching on the app in a few different ways by sort of giving an actual walkthrough just to kind of talk about like what, because everyone got their different scheduling process, right?
Richie: Yeah. Like you're talking about, you have the shared calendar color patterns, route talk to people, do the pure conversation route, and then there's spacing between they need to bear with my [00:37:00] hand. Do encourage people to check out the website, check out the apple, touch on that a bit. But just to give you a sense of what's happening in this app.
Richie: What's the deal here? So one big piece is setting your own dating schedule. That intentional plan to head dating schedule. Mm-hmm. That sets up when you're available, so it doesn't commit you to anything. It just says, Hey, this is when you could buck with me. That's piece one. Then depending on whether, if you, if your other partners are also using pie, then it's super easy.
Richie: It just like links up all the calories automatically you'll find. When times are blocked based on your Google calendar, your partner's Google Calendar, whatever you set up. And they can even jump in and see when you're available in book writing. Like you don't have to, uh, give a heads up or you can send out an invitation, right?
Richie: Not it's a, a link. You can fire into any chat, WhatsApp, Facebook message. Um, and the great thing there is it gives us time options, right? So it'll say, this is when this person's actually [00:38:00] available. Here are the boundaries and all that. And then as time gets booked up or life events come up, uh, that all gets blocked off automatically.
Richie: So, you know, kind of technical, but at the end of the day, it just means that you have you to, it's an arranging of data as simple as here's the link. And you can set it and forget it and you'll just see, oh, now I've got a date in two weeks. Or, oh, now we've booked the next, we've booked three dates in the next six weeks.
Richie: Often. I wanted to see them every about every two weeks. Fantastic. Um, so that's a big piece of it. The privacy piece. I mean, there's a ton of detail, but the bottom line is I've just made everything controllable. Would you want who to see? Justified partner adjusted across the board. How much time do you need ahead of time?
Richie: If you don't want someone booking a date like two hours before mm-hmm. They show up at your front door, all of all of that's controllable. So, that's, that's what lets you kind of protect everyone's privacy and impact, kind of be [00:39:00] discreet without underhar or hiding things. Yeah, so like, that's, that's kinda the core of, it's, it's, yeah, it's simple, but it's just really well adapted.
Richie: I've been talking, like I said, to dozens. Reading posts from hundreds of people, just getting a good idea of what does our community need. Yeah. So it's built right into the app. And I think it's pulling that all together that makes it a potential, a much better option than Google, even for people that do have that really sophisticated setup.
Richie: It's just about making it easy then.
Ellecia: Yeah.
Ellecia: Yeah.
Ellecia: Yeah. What, um, and you're, are you like beta testing it now? How, how's that work?
Richie: So, yeah, this is a, a real neat kind of neat time. So, it's, it's album beta test right now. It is, it's functionally usable. I've got, I think just about 20 people kind of with accounts using it more or less.
Richie: The big thing I need right now is just feedback from the community. [00:40:00] Yeah. People that get in there, use it, tell me, you know, how it's improving things, how it's not, what more do you need, what's not working? Yeah, I, I'm serious about wanting this to be like a great tool for the community. So, I think I've got, I've set probably 30 more spots where I'm like, Hey, you know, the feedback you give me, you can have this free forever.
Richie: Um, because it's just super valuable to get feedback from that community. So if people are interested in signing up totally free for about the next 30 people. The afterward I'm still keeping, it's like, it'll be around seven bucks a month. Nice. You know, this is a, uh, again, it's about having impact and also recognizing the more, if your partner's on it, life's that much better.
Richie: So. I don't wanna throw up cost barriers. Just get everyone on it. And then you don't have to talk that much about scheduling anymore.
Ellecia: Yeah, yeah, yeah. May.
Richie: But for now yeah. Jump in and test it. Play with it just all I ask is feedback.
Ellecia: Yeah. Yeah. How, [00:41:00] how do people find it?
Richie: Sure. Well, the website, uh, is love Pie, which is, uh, pie spelled PYE.
Richie: That's a clutter branding term there. www.love pie.com. Um, there's a weak list function there. If you sign up, I'll shoot you an email and, um, get you set up. Or if you, if you're so bold, you can go directly to it's, um, I think app. Do love pie.com/sign up. Bit of a mouthful. Either Winnie, happy to get you sent up with an account.
Richie: And I will, you know, I'll probably bug you with an email or two or a Facebook chat or whatever just to get, get that feedback and make sure it's like, got everything that you need to manage your dating life.
Ellecia: Yeah. Yeah. Amazing. And I'll put that in the, I'll put that in the, uh, show notes for
Ellecia: sure.
Richie: Sure.
Richie: Spelling it out where it's like, oh, or just click the link below,
Ellecia: or, you know, whatever. It's supposed
Richie: break down [00:42:00] sideways.
Ellecia: I rarely, when I'm listening to things, I will rarely open the show notes and some people are always open the show notes. So I think both are really important.
Richie: Yeah. I'm curious, I'm to hear from you as well. Like, I, I, I've, you know, shared a few of the things I've picked up in terms of tips that I've heard out there and used myself. What other tips do you have, like outside of. Using pie. What, what other tips do you have for people just managing the emotions and the logistics around planning your dating life?
Ellecia: Hmm. I think, uh, in this regard, I think there is a lot of expectation that is a holdover from monogamy. A lot of like entitlement to partners time that needs to be put, put in the trash bin. Um. If we treat our partners like autonomous individuals who get to manage their own time it does a couple of things.
Ellecia: One, [00:43:00] it makes us be more intentional with our relationships, right? We put more intentional effort into them rather than just assuming, well, he doesn't have a date, so the rest of his time's mine and then being upset that he made a date in his free time. Which I think is super common. Yeah. So, so getting rid of that like entitlement to our partners, especially if we're nesting or parenting with, with someone we, that happens even more this like just assumption that everything is together and, and if you can kind drop that a bit, it opens, it does a lot of things, right.
Ellecia: It prevents resentment and miscommunication, but it also creates this need. To have conversations, to like, to be, have more intimacy with each other actually, because we aren't making assumptions about, well, I guess we're gonna be sitting on the couch Thursday night.
Richie: Yeah. The junctional time.
Ellecia: Yeah.
Richie: Like what if I actually had to walk in with my, [00:44:00] my home partner, right.
Richie: And like, oh, well if, if I said I'm gonna be with you for, you know, Thursday nights, uh. Yeah, maybe I'm thinking I'm not just gonna spend it on my phone or watching Netflix. Maybe I'm planning ahead a little bit. Yeah, right. It does change. It's a, it's a bit of a attitude change. I agree. Yeah. I, I
Ellecia: actually had to start doing that because I kept hurting my own feelings.
Ellecia: I kept having my feelings hurt because I had an expectation that I didn't voice that wasn't like nobody did anything wrong. I just thought we were gonna be hanging out. Since you didn't have other plans. I kept getting my own feelings hurt and I was like, well, this is really dumb.
Richie: Yeah. Oh, dumb iss the right word, but I know where you're coming from.
Richie: Yeah. Right. Yeah. Like, that, yeah. It comes back to like, yeah, date time is not taking up by dates. Maybe that by default is just personal time, [00:45:00] free time. Like for like whatever you need. Yeah. Right. And that there's nothing wrong with that.
Ellecia: No.
Richie: Right. As long as everyone knows that, oh, like I've actually blocked this off for myself.
Richie: Right. May I need me? I said I was gonna be available next Thursday, but you know what? It's been a tough month. I'm gonna, I'm gonna set, I'm just gonna block this off for myself. Maybe next time I'll see you. I'll see you on Thursday after. Yeah.
Ellecia: Yeah, yeah, yeah. I think, I think just that little thing will make a huge difference for so many people.
Richie: Yeah. When I, I When you're talking about couples privilege Yes. Like just putting everyone on equal footing, like Yeah. Yeah. Everyone's gonna have to book, right? Yeah. Like respect my, I'm an I'll respect yours, right? Like, I'm not gonna just 'cause I'm your, you know, primary partner. Say like, I'm not gonna like book outside your windows.
Richie: I'm gonna respect your dating schedule. Going to the, you've, you've expressed intentional. Planning gear. I mean, [00:46:00] uh, I'll respect that. Like I'll follow that pattern, right? Yeah.
Ellecia: Yeah. Uh, and it also helps, I think that helps with co-parenting as well because you then you have less of a default parent and more intentional co-parenting.
Richie: Yeah. One thing I'm curious about for feedback from the community is, um, whether say, um. Say you and your home partner are like one, one of you has now arranged a date. Do you want that to block off your availability too, so you're automatically at home, right? Or is that a prompt to get a babysitter?
Richie: Like how, how do you want that to show up to other partners? I'm curious about how people handle those. Like, oh, who's on duty kinds of conversations.
Ellecia: Yeah.
Richie: Yeah. Um, 'cause I mean, that's And
Ellecia: are they having them?
Richie: Well, okay. Or yes. Or is it just, well, first out the [00:47:00] door wins. Right?
Ellecia: Right. Exactly. Yeah. Amazing. Amazing. This has been really amazing. I'm excited to play with the app some more, uh, especially now that I have like such a better understanding. Of, of what it is and how it works. I like, I downloaded it and I was like, yeah, cool, a calendar.
Ellecia: Uh, there's some things in here, I don't know, I'm busy and now I'm like, oh, what? Get in there, what don't?
Richie: So I, I've built this, like I mentioned I think earlier in the episode. I don't actually know how to code my background in the product side. So I've been using AI to do, to break the code, which is amazing.
Richie: 'cause normally this app would've taken a year and a half. You know what? Four months to write and I would've needed a staff. Like, it's kind of crazy what you can do and you like to get things out early, right? So it's, it's a weird spot where I'm like, yeah, I kind of know this isn't perfect yet, but I'm, I need people in it.
Richie: So, yeah, I get, I've actually made a few tweaks since then. Like [00:48:00] now when you jump in it, it asks you, it kind of makes your. Helped you set up your dating schedule before you even fall on the calendar so you can kinda see Oh yeah, I, I get it. That's, those are where my, when, when I'm available and Oh, my Cal Google calendar's there.
Richie: Yeah. Yeah. So yeah, that's the kind of feedback I need.
Ellecia: Yeah. That's fantastic. I love that. I love that so much. Thank you so much for coming on the show.
Richie: Thanks for hosting. Thanks for the conversation. Hopefully this helps, hopefully this helps people think differently about. The, uh, the L word.
Ellecia: Yeah.
Richie: Logistics.
Ellecia: Yeah. Yeah. I think it's important. It is important stuff. Whew. If you've ever sat with three calendars open, two phones buzzing, one partner sign in the background, you know exactly why this episode matters. Richie's reminder is that scheduling isn't just boring admin. It's where trust and privacy and safety either get reinforced or slowly unravel.
Ellecia: So if you wanna check out Richie's App Pie and maybe snag one of those free beta spots, [00:49:00] head to love pie.com. I'll pop the link in the show notes For those of you who like to click on things, if today's conversation got you nodding along and laughing or texting your partner that you need a better calendar system, do me a favor.
Ellecia: Follow this podcast wherever you're listening or watching right now. Rate and review it. If you've got 30 seconds, it helps other polyamorous or poly curious folks find us. Of course, share this episode with your poly, with your polycule or your group chat. Trust me, they'll thank you when you stop triple booking yourself, and that's it for today.
Ellecia: So until next time, remember that you're not broken, you're not alone, and you're definitely not monogamous. Bye.